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Ralph Bakshi
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ibaraki
Stomper
Joined: 20 Oct 2004
Posts: 258
Location: Ohio
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 Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 5:52 am Post subject: Thief and the Cobbler (Mr. Bakshi, I would LOVE your input) |
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Mr. Bakshi, please, I would love to hear your input (if you have any) on Richard Williams' butchered masterpiece, The Thief and the Cobbler.
A lot of us have been waiting for years for a fully restored complete edition based on Williams' workprint version. But now it seems Miramax is releasing the heavily re-edited musical version on DVD pretty soon. What the fuck? seriously.
Do you know much about this film? And if so, I just would like to hear what you have to say about it. I've always been curious what you think about it. |
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Ralph B
The Man Himself
Joined: 16 Aug 2004
Posts: 117
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Over the years Richard would show me various magnificently animated sequences from the picture. Richard was very much like DeKooning, the painter, where he kept changing the finished product. It was fine when he was working for himself and I told him when he sold the film to WB that unless he met a delivery date there would be trouble. There was, and I never got to see the original cut, so I can't compare to what I saw in the theatre. I know when they took the film away from Richard and gave it to some hack animator to finish, it was like killing Richards baby. It had a lot to do with him leaving the industry. When I had a fight on Heavy Traffic with the producer, half way through the film it was offered to Chuck Jones to finish. Chuck turned them down, saying it was Bakshi's film and only Bakshi's film. I didn't even know him at the time. Richard didn't have the same luck I had. But that's showbiz... |
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Sobieniak
Stomper
Joined: 05 Sep 2004
Posts: 378
Location: Toledo, OH
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| Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 2:23 am Post subject: |
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| Ralph B wrote: | | Over the years Richard would show me various magnificently animated sequences from the picture. Richard was very much like DeKooning, the painter, where he kept changing the finished product. It was fine when he was working for himself and I told him when he sold the film to WB that unless he met a delivery date there would be trouble. There was, and I never got to see the original cut, so I can't compare to what I saw in the theatre. I know when they took the film away from Richard and gave it to some hack animator to finish, it was like killing Richards baby. It had a lot to do with him leaving the industry. |
That's sad and very true of what happened.
| Quote: | | When I had a fight on Heavy Traffic with the producer, half way through the film it was offered to Chuck Jones to finish. Chuck turned them down, saying it was Bakshi's film and only Bakshi's film. I didn't even know him at the time. Richard didn't have the same luck I had. But that's showbiz... |
I'm only surprised to learn that Jones would've finished it, but thought about you before turning it down, that was really lucky of him to do so, and to let you finish what you've already started from the beginning.
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Christopher M. Sobieniak @ St. Toledo
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ibaraki
Stomper
Joined: 20 Oct 2004
Posts: 258
Location: Ohio
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 12:18 am Post subject: |
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| Ralph B wrote: | | Over the years Richard would show me various magnificently animated sequences from the picture. Richard was very much like DeKooning, the painter, where he kept changing the finished product. It was fine when he was working for himself and I told him when he sold the film to WB that unless he met a delivery date there would be trouble. There was, and I never got to see the original cut, so I can't compare to what I saw in the theatre. I know when they took the film away from Richard and gave it to some hack animator to finish, it was like killing Richards baby. It had a lot to do with him leaving the industry. When I had a fight on Heavy Traffic with the producer, half way through the film it was offered to Chuck Jones to finish. Chuck turned them down, saying it was Bakshi's film and only Bakshi's film. I didn't even know him at the time. Richard didn't have the same luck I had. But that's showbiz... |
I still believe to this day one of the best animated sequences on film is the War Room sequence toward the end. It gets me everytime I see it. The detail just blows my mind.
I have a copy of the workprint version on CD-R. (It is somewhere at my parents house, misplaced it when I moved out and now that I moved back I need to find it) Various animated sequences mixed with storyboards. Also has footage that was cut out of the final release. If you ever want a copy... |
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| Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 2:06 am Post subject: |
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| ibaraki wrote: | | I still believe to this day one of the best animated sequences on film is the War Room sequence toward the end. It gets me everytime I see it. The detail just blows my mind. |
I personally enjoy the bit where the Thief walks up the stairs while they break part, causing bits and pieces of wood to tumble, with him still climbing up til nothing was left! That's real attention to detail there!
| Quote: | | I have a copy of the workprint version on CD-R. (It is somewhere at my parents house, misplaced it when I moved out and now that I moved back I need to find it) Various animated sequences mixed with storyboards. Also has footage that was cut out of the final release. If you ever want a copy... |
Hearing that you have it now, I'm more than happy to see for myself despite the quality I can expect from a bootleg (trust me, I've been tape trading for 7 years).  |
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EVA Unit 04
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Ralph B wrote: | | When I had a fight on Heavy Traffic with the producer, half way through the film it was offered to Chuck Jones to finish. Chuck turned them down, saying it was Bakshi's film and only Bakshi's film. I didn't even know him at the time. Richard didn't have the same luck I had. But that's showbiz... |
I've read about that, I'm guessing Mr. Jones knew about you and your film Heavy Traffic. |
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kurtamayaguy
Minion of Scortch 1
Joined: 07 Jun 2006
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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Animators in Australia (I worked there for 5 years) were also highly impressed with D. William's work on Thief and the Cobbler, and agreed 100% with the niceity of the war machine work, and the botched additions coming from WB collaboration. Unfortunately, Disney just closed their Aussie division.
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